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Help[Opinions] Re: No
in reply to a message by Ottilie
If the names Andrea and Charlotte (and all their related forms) just mean "man," then they are all truly terrible names to give to little girls.
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Oh, no they aren't.
bah
bah
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For whatever it's worth ... this site has two theories about the origin of Charles.
From the Germanic name Karl, which was derived from a Germanic word meaning "man". However, an alternative theory states that it is derived from the common Germanic element hari meaning "army, warrior".
Believing the most widely accepted or authoritative answer to a question simply because it is said to be authoritative is foolish. Karl/Charles might even have been based on two earlier names that had different meanings but sounded similar, and both theories are right. Maybe the original "hari" name was short for something, and the full meaning is lost forever. Anyway, etymology's rarely an exact science.
Of course you can't change the origin of a name or word but I think Charlotte's complete "meaning" - what it means to people now, besides just the etymological one that "meant" something to people in the distant past - has to be different from that of Karl, since Charlotte is a female name. My name dictionary (one that cites good sources) says:
French Charlotte, in imitation of Italian Carlotta, feminine of Carlo (Charles) from Teutonic Karl ('man, countryman, husbandman'). Introduced into England in the 17th c. but popularized by George III's queen, Charlotte Sophia, in the latter half of the 18th c. Remained very popular until the beginning of the 20th c....
So for the first English speakers to use Charlotte, it "meant" ... not "man" but a reference to a queen. It was just a royal, noble female name. It never meant "man" to those who adopted it. They probably knew it was a form of Charles, but Charles had been Charles for centuries and nobody cared what it meant, it was just another royal name.
From the Germanic name Karl, which was derived from a Germanic word meaning "man". However, an alternative theory states that it is derived from the common Germanic element hari meaning "army, warrior".
Believing the most widely accepted or authoritative answer to a question simply because it is said to be authoritative is foolish. Karl/Charles might even have been based on two earlier names that had different meanings but sounded similar, and both theories are right. Maybe the original "hari" name was short for something, and the full meaning is lost forever. Anyway, etymology's rarely an exact science.
Of course you can't change the origin of a name or word but I think Charlotte's complete "meaning" - what it means to people now, besides just the etymological one that "meant" something to people in the distant past - has to be different from that of Karl, since Charlotte is a female name. My name dictionary (one that cites good sources) says:
French Charlotte, in imitation of Italian Carlotta, feminine of Carlo (Charles) from Teutonic Karl ('man, countryman, husbandman'). Introduced into England in the 17th c. but popularized by George III's queen, Charlotte Sophia, in the latter half of the 18th c. Remained very popular until the beginning of the 20th c....
So for the first English speakers to use Charlotte, it "meant" ... not "man" but a reference to a queen. It was just a royal, noble female name. It never meant "man" to those who adopted it. They probably knew it was a form of Charles, but Charles had been Charles for centuries and nobody cared what it meant, it was just another royal name.
This message was edited 6/20/2015, 11:43 PM
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Can I ask for the title of that name dictionary? It seems interesting!
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It's getting old (1980s)
Dunkling & Gosling New American Dictionary of First Names Publisher is Signet
The authors are English but the dictionary covers usage in both the US and Britain.
Definitely worth the penny price (at least in US) if you're paying to have some other used books shipped.
Dunkling & Gosling New American Dictionary of First Names Publisher is Signet
The authors are English but the dictionary covers usage in both the US and Britain.
Definitely worth the penny price (at least in US) if you're paying to have some other used books shipped.
This message was edited 6/21/2015, 9:48 AM
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They aren't related, nor are they terrible to use for girls. Meanings don't matter much any more.
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I never said Amanda and Charlotte are related only that they have the same meaning. Which, according to you, is "man." And meanings are very important to some people. For example, to me. I'm not sure what you mean by "any more," since I don't imagine the meaning of names was very important to the majority of people in ages past either. But this site wouldn't even exist if the meaning of names was not important to anyone.
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You made a brain typo here, but a pretty funny one. You said Amanda when you meant to say Andrea. Amanda doesn't mean man, it means "beloved" or whatever. But it actually sounds like a-man-duh when it's said aloud and Amandas get teased for this. Therefore, it actually "means" man in a very real, earth-sign sense, much more than the very airy way Charlotte means man. Isn't that funny?
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I think you're taking this far too personally.
What I mean is that no one is going to say to Andrea, "Hahahahaha, your name means MAN! You're a MAN!" Meanings matter or are of interest to people who are interested in names, but not much to the general public in Western Society. And you kind of did say they were related, in the message I replied to before this one.
What I mean is that no one is going to say to Andrea, "Hahahahaha, your name means MAN! You're a MAN!" Meanings matter or are of interest to people who are interested in names, but not much to the general public in Western Society. And you kind of did say they were related, in the message I replied to before this one.
This message was edited 6/21/2015, 3:44 AM
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