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ArchivesRe: The surname Diesel
in reply to a message by Getb
Actually, most of the bearers of this surname Diesel in South America are of Hispanic origin, also bearing a Spanish first name. You are right that some people might be German, but as you can see, this surname Diesel is rare, not as popular as Johnson or Jones, making it highly unlikely that there may be some Diesels living in South America and in Asia. I'd say 97% of Diesel in United States and Canada are of German origin, and 90% of Diesels in Europe are living in Germany, making your idea even more unlikely. In the Philippines, there are a few people who bear this surname Diesel, and according to my research, they are Filipino of origin. Variants include Dies, Diez, Dienzo, Diezon, and Diezel, possibly a variant form of Filipino surname Dizon, of Chinese origin. These variants sound Spanish, but they are very rare Filipino surnames. The surname Dies and Diez are most popular in Spain than other places in the world, but that doesn't mean that the Filipinos that bear this same surname are consider Spanish.
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I am Peruvian and I know the Philippines have Spanish influence, but let me tell you "Diesel" has not the sound of a Spanish name... And slaves and servants usually got their surnames from their owners or bosses in the Spanish empire, so German bosses/slave owners could have given their surnames to Filipino and Spanish people (they might have been few but then these Filipino and south Americans could have grown in numbers through generations of large families, poorer people tend to have larger families due to many factors and under foreign conquests natives are always the poorest people around)
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Hmm... You are right. There are many Filipinos who also inherited Spanish surnames... So that means that the Filipino surnames Dies and Diaz are perhaps of Spanish in origin and were brought here to the Philippines, in which they inherited. This perhaps also applies to Diesel, a surname that was brought over here to the Philippines. I also read that the Filipinos surnames could only be Filipino, Chinese, Muslim, or Spanish surnames, the most common ones.
I have never heard of German bosses or slave owners, and that the Spanish people were once slaves under Germans... and if that was true, that means the German surname Diesel was brought over to the Philippines, in which the Filipinos later inherited. Hmm... I try to dig in deeper...
I have never heard of German bosses or slave owners, and that the Spanish people were once slaves under Germans... and if that was true, that means the German surname Diesel was brought over to the Philippines, in which the Filipinos later inherited. Hmm... I try to dig in deeper...
This message was edited 7/27/2012, 11:15 PM
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I never said that Spanish people were slave under Germans... But under the Spanish empire any European was fair game to become an owner of slaves or a boss in the Spanish empire... We have in Peru two towns inhabited by many Germans (although that happened a long time after the country became a republic)... "Dies" and "Diaz" are Spanish surnames (-ez means "son of" and "día" means "day) but the particle "-el" at the end of the word is unheard of in Spanish surnames... I guess we have Spanish words that end in it like "anaquel" but not Spanish surnames ("anaquel" is a flatboard mounted on a wall to store stuff, books and things you will sell mostly, it is a synonim of "estante")
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Díaz has nothing to do with día as you can see at http://www.ancestry.com/name-origin?surname=diaz.
Also, I don't understand all this talk about slave owners in relation to the surname Diesel. There were thousands upon thousands of people from Europe and Asia who emigrated to South America from Europe and Asia in the last couple of centuries, e.g., Sabatini and Messi from Italy, Pinochet and Betancourt from France, Fujimura and Fujimori from Japan, etc. I have three friends named Ivancic (Serbo-Croatian), Baibich (Jewish) and Malouf (Arabic) who were born in either Argentina or Brazil. Diesel was simply one of these migrants.
And for an example of a Spanish surname ending in -el, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chico_Carrasquel.
Also, I don't understand all this talk about slave owners in relation to the surname Diesel. There were thousands upon thousands of people from Europe and Asia who emigrated to South America from Europe and Asia in the last couple of centuries, e.g., Sabatini and Messi from Italy, Pinochet and Betancourt from France, Fujimura and Fujimori from Japan, etc. I have three friends named Ivancic (Serbo-Croatian), Baibich (Jewish) and Malouf (Arabic) who were born in either Argentina or Brazil. Diesel was simply one of these migrants.
And for an example of a Spanish surname ending in -el, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chico_Carrasquel.
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You are right, but then again it was reasonable to consider the possibility of a Spanish origin, in which I have researched in depth more and concluded it most likely may have been of German origin. The Hispanic Diesels are perhaps of mixblood also, having German heritage in them. In the Philippines, I am not so sure, my level concerning it may be German is 30%, but I'll try to find out more.
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Marc is right (however I mentioned slave ownership and servants taking their surnames from bosses to add deepness to the case I was making) and the bottomline of what Marc and I wanted to say is that your Charls are undertestimating migration... It has happened a lot in south America... Brazilians, Argentinians and Chileans are mostly foreigners to the land, and even in Peru there is a lot of migration...
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I wasn't really underestimating migration, but I was keeping everything in mind. I knew the surname Diesel was German, but the Hispanic Diesel threw me off, seemingly pointing of another possible origin that I maybe missing. I've looked at another surname, Dietrich, a very common surname, and this surname is found throughout Europe, also in South America. The surname Diesel is a pet form of Dietrich, meaning the two surnames are related.
I have researched 100s of surnames, and I know not to make the same mistakes again. My point is, we shouldn't really narrow down the origins of a surname. For example, the surname Fish, a very common surname. Not all people with the surname Fish are of English heritage. Some are German, Spanish, Native American and others. If so, there is a possibility that their meaning & origins is not the same with the English Fish, meaning there is of another origin. Same with Diesel. There are the Filipino and Spanish Diesel, and if so, there is a POSSIBILITY that they aren't from the German theudo OR they did not originate from Germany. I understand about the migration of South America, but as you can see many of them are Spanish people, and there are many Native Southern Americans too, and If there are Diesels in South America, then there is a POSSIBILITY that there are Spanish or Native Americans that do bear this same surname, which I have found many Hispanic people with this same surname. I just PROPOSED the possibility, and many times I get it right. There is no reason to disregard possible origins based on speculations and hypothesis, because usually they are right. It just needs evidence to support that it is an origin, or it is not.
I have researched 100s of surnames, and I know not to make the same mistakes again. My point is, we shouldn't really narrow down the origins of a surname. For example, the surname Fish, a very common surname. Not all people with the surname Fish are of English heritage. Some are German, Spanish, Native American and others. If so, there is a possibility that their meaning & origins is not the same with the English Fish, meaning there is of another origin. Same with Diesel. There are the Filipino and Spanish Diesel, and if so, there is a POSSIBILITY that they aren't from the German theudo OR they did not originate from Germany. I understand about the migration of South America, but as you can see many of them are Spanish people, and there are many Native Southern Americans too, and If there are Diesels in South America, then there is a POSSIBILITY that there are Spanish or Native Americans that do bear this same surname, which I have found many Hispanic people with this same surname. I just PROPOSED the possibility, and many times I get it right. There is no reason to disregard possible origins based on speculations and hypothesis, because usually they are right. It just needs evidence to support that it is an origin, or it is not.
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But Spanish surnames never or almost never finish with "el"
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Sorry, what I mean't to say was, "German Slaveowners who has slaves that are of Spanish origin." You said, ""Diesel" has not the sound of a Spanish name" and "German bosses/slave owners could have given their surnames to Filipino and Spanish people." meaning that German slaveowners who owned slaves that are Spanish or Native American transferred their German surname to their slaves or servants, the slaves or servant recieving the surname Diesel, and that there is no way Diesel is of Spanish origin, as you say. This means that there were perhaps 100s of Spanish people or Native American people enslaved or owned by many of German slaveowners, hence the saying, "Spanish people were once slaves under Germans", which I don't think that's true, or perhaps I'm missing out on history. But I wondered if there are any German slaveowners or German bosses that has Spanish or Native American servants? By the way, I am comming to think that the Diesel surname of South America is perhaps of German origin. I don't know why so many of them are living there, well, at least 200 Diesels are living in Brazil, and at least 1000 people in this world bears this surname. The one in the Philippines though, is a mystery. Of German origin? seems unlikely... but I'll look into it.
This message was edited 7/28/2012, 10:23 AM
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