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Help[Facts] Re: Esme / Esmee
in reply to a message by Jacks
Esmé is the male form (EZ-may), Esmée the female form (EZ-mee) in French, though in the modern era that is observed less and less and Esmé now figures most often as a female name. It's Old French, based on past participle form of the verb esmer 'to love, esteem' (Latin aestimare 'to value, esteem') which was absorbed by the verb amer to became the modern French aimer as in J'aime Paris. Based on nothing more than it's visual resemblance, some try to connect it with Esmeralda but it's baseless folk etymology, nothing more.
The name was brought to Scotland in the 16th C. and has been used occasionally as a male name ever since, often without the accent (which gives pronunciation guidance in French but in English is largely ornamental, the absence of it doesn't change the English pronunciation at all).
In Scotland the female form Edmé arose. The reason for the change from S to D isn't clear but is generally put down to the influence of co-existing given names Esmond and Edmund. Edmé and Edmée are exclusively English/Scottish in use, in spite of the Frenchified accent marks.
Famous bearers - Esmé Stuart, cousin of James VI of Scotland (1542-83). Director Esmé Collings. Authors Esmé Raji Codell and Esmé Ellis. Actually Irish dramatist Lennox Robinson's real name was Esmé Stuart Lennox Robinson (the first Esmé Stuart was 1st Duke of Lennox...Robinson's folks were clearly fans). Esmé features in Saki's Chronicles of Clovis. Esmé dolls.
Devon
The name was brought to Scotland in the 16th C. and has been used occasionally as a male name ever since, often without the accent (which gives pronunciation guidance in French but in English is largely ornamental, the absence of it doesn't change the English pronunciation at all).
In Scotland the female form Edmé arose. The reason for the change from S to D isn't clear but is generally put down to the influence of co-existing given names Esmond and Edmund. Edmé and Edmée are exclusively English/Scottish in use, in spite of the Frenchified accent marks.
Famous bearers - Esmé Stuart, cousin of James VI of Scotland (1542-83). Director Esmé Collings. Authors Esmé Raji Codell and Esmé Ellis. Actually Irish dramatist Lennox Robinson's real name was Esmé Stuart Lennox Robinson (the first Esmé Stuart was 1st Duke of Lennox...Robinson's folks were clearly fans). Esmé features in Saki's Chronicles of Clovis. Esmé dolls.
Devon
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Replies
In addition, in the movie Babe, Farmer Hoggett's wife is named Esme. And the novelist JD Salinger apparently wrote a book entitled, _To Esme, with Love and Squalor_. (Possibly titled differently in the UK.)
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Thanks, I know that this is kind of an opinion thing, but how would you respond if its was pronounced Ez-me or Ez-may? Is it too commonly pronounced Ez-may to switch it up or is it still not recognized widely and many aren't sure what the "proper" one is, so it wouldn't matter because everyone would have their own pron.? *** I also like both pronounciations & I'm torn.
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I'm pregnant and Esme is on our list for a girl, said EZ-may. I speak French so it's hard for me to see EZ-mee on Esme just like it's bloody impossible for me to go to dan-YELL for Daniel.
I'm sure there is a bit of confusion about the name and most aren't sure of the proper pronunciation but you'll most often get EZ-may or ES-may (people trying to be fancy and 'correct' without knowing that it should be the hard z sound) because it's not equated with Aimee the way it should be. You'd probably only get EZ-mee out of a French speaker and only if you spelt it in the feminine form Esmee. To get EZ-mee out of Esme in an English-speaking mouth will be an uphill climb and frankly far more trouble than it's worth. Especially if you like both. EZ-may is the usual. You might do a poll to verify that just to explore the avenue fully.
We're not using accents either - we live in England, it's a moot point ;o) Esme Catherine Annuska is probably the front-funner at this stage but I have until Christmas to mess with that ;o)
Devon
I'm sure there is a bit of confusion about the name and most aren't sure of the proper pronunciation but you'll most often get EZ-may or ES-may (people trying to be fancy and 'correct' without knowing that it should be the hard z sound) because it's not equated with Aimee the way it should be. You'd probably only get EZ-mee out of a French speaker and only if you spelt it in the feminine form Esmee. To get EZ-mee out of Esme in an English-speaking mouth will be an uphill climb and frankly far more trouble than it's worth. Especially if you like both. EZ-may is the usual. You might do a poll to verify that just to explore the avenue fully.
We're not using accents either - we live in England, it's a moot point ;o) Esme Catherine Annuska is probably the front-funner at this stage but I have until Christmas to mess with that ;o)
Devon
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awesome! congrats. Very nice choice.
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Devon? Did I read that right... you're pregnant?!
Devon? Did I read that right... you're pregnant?!
Devon? Did I read that right... you're pregnant?!
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Yes, due December 12th they tell me but I always go over so more like December 14-20. We have to have genetic testing so our 'miscarriage stage' is a bit longer than usual - up to 15 weeks so we're still in 'wait-n-see' mode for a bit here ;o)
So Esme Catherine Annuska is getting kudos....wonder if it's Christmasy enough? LOL
Devon
So Esme Catherine Annuska is getting kudos....wonder if it's Christmasy enough? LOL
Devon
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I give you the Scrooge Response ...
... "Christmas? Humbug!" At least where names are concerned. I feel so sorry for all the little Natalies and Hollys - however, I've got a step-great-niece (I think - branches of the family tree get rather tangled) named Holly who was born in the South African autumn and is delightful, but still.
And there was an English judge, in the fifties I think, whose name was Christmas Humphries; he was a Buddhist, and I've always wondered if it was cause and effect.
Annuska is the only one of your three choices that puzzles me - I'm used to other variants like Annoushka, but that one's a first. Where did it originate? (Glad to see other people giving their offspring 3 names! I did, with great success, but most don't seem to enjoy the idea.)
Good luck!
... "Christmas? Humbug!" At least where names are concerned. I feel so sorry for all the little Natalies and Hollys - however, I've got a step-great-niece (I think - branches of the family tree get rather tangled) named Holly who was born in the South African autumn and is delightful, but still.
And there was an English judge, in the fifties I think, whose name was Christmas Humphries; he was a Buddhist, and I've always wondered if it was cause and effect.
Annuska is the only one of your three choices that puzzles me - I'm used to other variants like Annoushka, but that one's a first. Where did it originate? (Glad to see other people giving their offspring 3 names! I did, with great success, but most don't seem to enjoy the idea.)
Good luck!
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This is our 8th and all of them have 3 names. We're running out of names at this point LOL We both have them too - Dh is Mark Vincent Emil and my full is Amy Devon Elizabeth. The third mn is always a reflection of their ethnicity - Kai, Sandor, Zoltan, Iosefo, Elisapeta, Aladar, Mariska and....
Annuska is Hungarian, diminutive nickname (officially, fortunately Hungarian bureacracy can't reach us in England) of Anna, my grandmother's name.
I have a think of subtlety but appropriateness so anything obvious like Natalie, Holly, Ivy, Mary, Merry, Christmas, Christ-anything, Joseph, all out of the question. I might think about Balthasar though ;o) For me it's more Tessa, Clara, Stella, Tasha, Helen...names that 'feel' warm to me. My BIL born around the same time this one is due is named Warwick. Not 'Christmasy' to most but I picture red berries for some reason and think his name is very December appropriate LOL....what can I say, we have 8 kids so I'm clearly a bit on the 'weird' side ;o)
Devon
Annuska is Hungarian, diminutive nickname (officially, fortunately Hungarian bureacracy can't reach us in England) of Anna, my grandmother's name.
I have a think of subtlety but appropriateness so anything obvious like Natalie, Holly, Ivy, Mary, Merry, Christmas, Christ-anything, Joseph, all out of the question. I might think about Balthasar though ;o) For me it's more Tessa, Clara, Stella, Tasha, Helen...names that 'feel' warm to me. My BIL born around the same time this one is due is named Warwick. Not 'Christmasy' to most but I picture red berries for some reason and think his name is very December appropriate LOL....what can I say, we have 8 kids so I'm clearly a bit on the 'weird' side ;o)
Devon
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Big Congrats!!!
Big Congrats!!!
Big Congrats!!!
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Thank you Devon :-) I'm tired of being told to pronounce Esmée (one of my favourites, I pronounceit EZ-mee) as ess-MAY ...
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So its pronounced EZ-Me for a girl with an 'e' sound like Chloe?
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Not in South Africa, it isn't. Here it's exclusively feminine - a boy named Esme would have a lot in common with a boy named Sue - and we invariably pronounce it EZ-may. It's a bit dated now - Esmes tend to be older women - but I expect it'll be back.
We had an actress of that name - radio, TV and I thnk stage though I never saw her live. Esme Euvrard. Definitely a grandmotherly figure - at one time she advertised washing powder.
We had an actress of that name - radio, TV and I thnk stage though I never saw her live. Esme Euvrard. Definitely a grandmotherly figure - at one time she advertised washing powder.
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