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Help[Opinions] Fake Irish?
What's a fake Irish name and what exactly constitutes such?
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Naming your kid Aiden,Kennedy,Rory doesn't make them Irish. Most of them are surnames turned fn or they are pulled from literature. I would say not fake but assumed to be Irish. Dylan,and Rhiannon are Welsh but many asuume they are Irish.A lot of Irish kids are named Thomas,Mary,Michael,Anne,ect.
I don't think I will use them b/c everywhere you turn there's a child named an Irish name.It annoys the hell out of me to continously see cutesy spellings of these names.How many ways can you spell Reily,Caitlin,and Ryan?
I can't find any of theses trendy and popular names in my in my family tree throughout the generationseven w/ a maternal grandmother who was 100% Irish.
Brigid
Padrig
Deirdre
Helen
Mary
Kathleen not Katherine
George
Eileen
Seamus
these were in my tree.
*************************************************
Fields are spoiled by weeds;
people, by delusion.
My &'s are
Chiara,Griffin,Melor,Zara,Iris,Dane
My #'s are Alastar,Lachlan,Carys,Finola,Gareth,Deidre
My !'s are
Grigore,Faina,Oleg,Kyril,Raisa
I don't think I will use them b/c everywhere you turn there's a child named an Irish name.It annoys the hell out of me to continously see cutesy spellings of these names.How many ways can you spell Reily,Caitlin,and Ryan?
I can't find any of theses trendy and popular names in my in my family tree throughout the generationseven w/ a maternal grandmother who was 100% Irish.
Brigid
Padrig
Deirdre
Helen
Mary
Kathleen not Katherine
George
Eileen
Seamus
these were in my tree.
*************************************************
Fields are spoiled by weeds;
people, by delusion.
My &'s are
Chiara,Griffin,Melor,Zara,Iris,Dane
My #'s are Alastar,Lachlan,Carys,Finola,Gareth,Deidre
My !'s are
Grigore,Faina,Oleg,Kyril,Raisa
This message was edited 11/5/2005, 4:23 PM
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I'm Irish on my father's side (although branches of this tree go back as far as 1826 in the US). The names of my various great, great great grandmothers etc are Catherine, Ann, Mary, Jane, Sarah. My grandmother was Hazel Bridget. The great and great-greats grandfathers etc. are Francis, Stephen, Matthew, George, Henry, Dominick. I have tons of genealogy from my father's side.
However, I assume that the culture was significantly anglicized by the 17/1800s and I even read that at one point it was against the law to name your child a gaelic name. I enjoy the resurgence of the "truly Irish" names but often find them hard to pronounce and spell. I do not, however, like the practice of naming girls with Irish surnames (Riley, Kennedy, et al). I don't even like it for boys unless it is a family name.
However, I assume that the culture was significantly anglicized by the 17/1800s and I even read that at one point it was against the law to name your child a gaelic name. I enjoy the resurgence of the "truly Irish" names but often find them hard to pronounce and spell. I do not, however, like the practice of naming girls with Irish surnames (Riley, Kennedy, et al). I don't even like it for boys unless it is a family name.
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It's not a phrase I've used so I can't define it, really. But one that springs to mind is Maegan - an annoying false-Irish pronunciation of a name, that isn't Irish to start with :-)
_____________________________________________________________________
♥Elinor♥
'Why do people with closed minds, always open their mouths?'
_____________________________________________________________________
♥Elinor♥
'Why do people with closed minds, always open their mouths?'
1
I would say that "fake Irish" would be the names that Americans and Australians think are Irish but did not originate in Ireland, such as Colleen and Megan.
Of course, during the last 30 years the Irish themselves have been affected by the same desire to find uncommon names for their kids that has spread across the entire "developed" world. So there evidently now are a few girls born in Ireland named Colleen, though I don't think any of them would be over about 25 years old.
The love of "Irish" names isn't something very new -- in the USA I think this is actually the oldest "ethnic name" fashion. The average American Colleen is now someplace between 40 and 60 years old, after all.
Of course, during the last 30 years the Irish themselves have been affected by the same desire to find uncommon names for their kids that has spread across the entire "developed" world. So there evidently now are a few girls born in Ireland named Colleen, though I don't think any of them would be over about 25 years old.
The love of "Irish" names isn't something very new -- in the USA I think this is actually the oldest "ethnic name" fashion. The average American Colleen is now someplace between 40 and 60 years old, after all.
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Yes, but Cailin was not used as a name in Ireland until very recently. It was just the Irish Gaelic word for "girl." It was considered about as appropriate to name your daughter Colleen or Cailin in Ireland as it would be considered appropriate to name your daughter Girl in the USA.
I have a friend who is now about 50 who is named Colleen. Her paternal grandmother was born in Ireland, and was extremely angry at her son for giving his daughter that name. My friend told me that it was years before her grandmother stopped asking her father "When are you going to give the colleen a real name?"
I have a friend who is now about 50 who is named Colleen. Her paternal grandmother was born in Ireland, and was extremely angry at her son for giving his daughter that name. My friend told me that it was years before her grandmother stopped asking her father "When are you going to give the colleen a real name?"
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I hope this explains it! :)
Well, I'll get my Irish naming book for this one!
Most real Irish names come from the old Gaelic such as Aidan (from Aodhan), Kieran (from Ciaran), Bridget (from Brigid), Enya ( from Eithne) .
So fake would be anything that isn't directly from the old Gaelic and those fall loosely into two catagories.
Irish Nicknames, Irishizations & Fakes, let me explain! :)
Irish nicknames came about in the 1900's when immagrints from Ireland to America wanted to a bit of their homeland so they used Irish nicknames, from regular names, for nicknames and then as first names! Examples: Annie (from Anne), Kate/Katie/Kitty (from Katherine), Nelly/Nora (from Eleanor), Molly (from Mary), Maggie/Peggy (from Margaret), Mike/Mickey (from Michael), Liam (from William), Pat/Paddy (from Patrick).
Now, Irishizations are Gaelic versions of other names like: Caitriona is a Gaelic form of the Latin name Catherine, Sheila is a form of Latin Cecilia, Siobhan is a form of Joan the feminie form of Hebrew name John, Maire & Moira are forms of the Hebrew name Mary & Miriam, Sean is a from of Hebrew John, Daibhead the Gaelic form of Hebrew name David, and Padraig is a form of the Latin name Patrick and Patrice (St.
Well, I'll get my Irish naming book for this one!
Most real Irish names come from the old Gaelic such as Aidan (from Aodhan), Kieran (from Ciaran), Bridget (from Brigid), Enya ( from Eithne) .
So fake would be anything that isn't directly from the old Gaelic and those fall loosely into two catagories.
Irish Nicknames, Irishizations & Fakes, let me explain! :)
Irish nicknames came about in the 1900's when immagrints from Ireland to America wanted to a bit of their homeland so they used Irish nicknames, from regular names, for nicknames and then as first names! Examples: Annie (from Anne), Kate/Katie/Kitty (from Katherine), Nelly/Nora (from Eleanor), Molly (from Mary), Maggie/Peggy (from Margaret), Mike/Mickey (from Michael), Liam (from William), Pat/Paddy (from Patrick).
Now, Irishizations are Gaelic versions of other names like: Caitriona is a Gaelic form of the Latin name Catherine, Sheila is a form of Latin Cecilia, Siobhan is a form of Joan the feminie form of Hebrew name John, Maire & Moira are forms of the Hebrew name Mary & Miriam, Sean is a from of Hebrew John, Daibhead the Gaelic form of Hebrew name David, and Padraig is a form of the Latin name Patrick and Patrice (St.
This message was edited 11/5/2005, 12:54 PM
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I was told that names like Kerry, Shannon and Colleen, which were at one time popular girls names here, were not girls names in Ireland because they are place names (Kerry, Shannon) or the Irish word for girl (Colleen). Even Tara, which is popular in Ireland now, became a girls name in the US first.
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A fake Irish name
This is a trend that has been going on. Ireland has been in, and everyone wants an "Irish" name. Names such as Caitlin, Brayden, Teagan, Erin, and others are thought to be "Irish" but are either not used there, or have are not etymologically connected to Ireland. They are used by people who have less than an ounce of Irish blood in them, to fit into the trend.
Does this make sense?
This is a trend that has been going on. Ireland has been in, and everyone wants an "Irish" name. Names such as Caitlin, Brayden, Teagan, Erin, and others are thought to be "Irish" but are either not used there, or have are not etymologically connected to Ireland. They are used by people who have less than an ounce of Irish blood in them, to fit into the trend.
Does this make sense?
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Minor nitpick. Of course, this is obvious to you, I know, but I'm saying it anyway for the record :-)
Approximately no one really names children "to fit into a trend" or because they really think "it's cool to be Irish (or Welsh or whatever ethnicity)." People in the same cultural time and place tend to share tastes - naturally & logically, if somewhat mysteriously. Irish-sounding names are like that in much of the US lately. When someone likes and uses an Irish or Irish-sounding name, they do it knowing it sounds fashionable; but that's not really their reason for using it, I don't think. I think they genuinely like the names, for reasons they can't explain.
So I take some exception to your tone of disdain for people who like and use Irish and Irish-sounding names, although in general they're not my thing..
I mean, I first started following name trends on the internet a couple years ago, and I thought my tastes must be so "different" -- but then I found out my favorites were actually pretty popular, and often the people who liked one, liked many of the others too. There's no way I could have been intentionally following a trend, because I'm not the most culturally in-touch person on the planet, let's just say. But it turned out I liked a lot of fashionable names that I hadn't heard anywhere for years prior to looking at name boards.
- chazda
Approximately no one really names children "to fit into a trend" or because they really think "it's cool to be Irish (or Welsh or whatever ethnicity)." People in the same cultural time and place tend to share tastes - naturally & logically, if somewhat mysteriously. Irish-sounding names are like that in much of the US lately. When someone likes and uses an Irish or Irish-sounding name, they do it knowing it sounds fashionable; but that's not really their reason for using it, I don't think. I think they genuinely like the names, for reasons they can't explain.
So I take some exception to your tone of disdain for people who like and use Irish and Irish-sounding names, although in general they're not my thing..
I mean, I first started following name trends on the internet a couple years ago, and I thought my tastes must be so "different" -- but then I found out my favorites were actually pretty popular, and often the people who liked one, liked many of the others too. There's no way I could have been intentionally following a trend, because I'm not the most culturally in-touch person on the planet, let's just say. But it turned out I liked a lot of fashionable names that I hadn't heard anywhere for years prior to looking at name boards.
- chazda
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I find that all the time too - I generally find that I'm slightly ahead of the trend, but if I find a name I suddenly like, I'll find that in the weeks following that name turns up everywhere! It happened with Lorien, and with Lilah, and a couple of others too.
None of us can stand outside the culture and poke fingers at it. We are all part of it, whether we like it or not.
♦ Chrisell ♦
All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us. - J.R.R. Tolkien.
None of us can stand outside the culture and poke fingers at it. We are all part of it, whether we like it or not.
All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us. - J.R.R. Tolkien.
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Okay gotcha, thanks.
And I totally see the Irish trend as well.
Not so much in naming but it's suddenly become cool to be Irish.
And I totally see the Irish trend as well.
Not so much in naming but it's suddenly become cool to be Irish.
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They are used by people who have less than an ounce of Irish blood in them, to fit into the trend.
I hate that. People that go "Oh, yes, I have Irish heritage. My great-aunt's cousins next-door-neighbour's cat comes from Ireland, which is why I feel fully justified to name my daughter Scoithniamh-Caoilfhionn-Irylynn and lecture people on "my" home country whenever possible."
- Maria
I hate that. People that go "Oh, yes, I have Irish heritage. My great-aunt's cousins next-door-neighbour's cat comes from Ireland, which is why I feel fully justified to name my daughter Scoithniamh-Caoilfhionn-Irylynn and lecture people on "my" home country whenever possible."
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I really don't know anyone who does that, because I live in an area of the US that has a large population of Irish descent. I'm half Irish/Italian myself. But I find it odd to even say that, when we go back so far on my father's side that none of my grandparents or great grandparents were born there or ever set foot there.
As my Mom always said, we're American first and foremost.
As my Mom always said, we're American first and foremost.
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Lol!
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LOL
~Heather~
~Heather~
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